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Uhhh…..
I suspect that J learned just as much from Lou as Lou learned from J. J just has a very weighty personality. Where as Lou is all over the place. J also has a better idea of style then Lou does.
They should have stayed together in Dino, but going around getting beer bottles thrown at you every night must have sucked.
I just think in an ideal world J and Lou would still be buddies. Well… Utopia this ain’t.
As far as how the general public is going to react to a guitarist J does not even make the list.
But J is the greatest guitarist as far as puting his personality into what he plays. NO-ONE could play what J plays! Even Malstrom! J is the only guitarist besides Hendrix who really put his GUTs into his playing. But Hendrix was still spending a lot of his energy just trying to get past the Marshal and the Strat. It was more his equipment then Hendrix. Hendrix had the courage to try and that is why he was great.
Where as J is all J Mascis! Nuthin’ like it!! No comparison!!!
J IS THE GREATEST!!!!!! …just don’t tell no one as the’ll might scoff….
Thanks for the link Allison!
The interview is actually at the Guitar World site
http://guitarcenter.com/interview/jmascis/jmascis_FRAME.shtmlI think that an Austrailian drum magazine has an interview with J.
And if anyone is confused by the twists and turns of this post I can understand it. Maybe another post needs to be made on this subject that is a little less openended. Maybe I guessed a little too much here… Sorry
Cool inteview!
I could have used more details on the cymbals though. Sounds like he’s into the new "K" Zildjians. But like, does he get all that sound out of just a couple of cymbals or does he have them all over the place?
Also I could have sworn I heard more then two tom toms on More Light but he says he just uses two. The same set up as on Gobblehoof but a Drum Workshop set with a Huge 28 inch bass drum! And a light weight Camco type pedal!
Thanks!
Oh yeah… I think the guitar shop he’s talking about in AMherst is Fretted Insterment Workshop which has got to have the best selection of used and new acoustic guitars you’ll see. But yes we could use a guitar center in western Mass. The more the better!
<FONT>[ June 03, 2001 09:44 PM: Message mutated 1 time, lastly by RuBrick ]</font>
OK
I have not been too many Dinosaur Jr. concerts. But the best one was the first one! I suppose it actually sucked, but I really enjoyed it.
November 1985
Eighth Route Army record release concert.
Location: Third floor ballroom of some arts center in Northampton Mass.
Opening: Dinosaur and the Melarians.I did not even know this concert was happening until I bumped into the band in Northampton that day and they offered to get me (and about 12 others) in free. J was mostly hanging out with his friend Arty. I think the cover of the first Dinosaur album has a picture of Arty on it (I may be wrong about that.) Arty was said to be special because he had an almost perfectly square head (not really, but that was what everybody said.) Maybe that is also his face on the BBC sessions CD…
J was wearing around this very nasty old parka with sort of artificial rat fur around the edge of the hood. Lous’ distinctive clothing included this dumb blue touch football vest with little ties at the sides.
J thought the concert location was cool because if you did not want to pay to get in you could just hang around out side the back door and look through the windows. He looked forward to doing this at future concerts. J and Arty were both offered an intoxicating beverage cleverly hidden in an orange juice carton but they politely refused. Well that’s just more for the rest of us I thought.
I had heard some of the Dinosaur album on the college radio stations in the area. I asked J if I should buy his album. He said: "Naaahhh…" He seemed pretty confident it was not going to make any money.
Anyway we all barged inside the ball room place saying: "We’re with the band!"
So the band gets on stage and ready to go. Lou starts yelling something at the top of his lungs. It sounds like he’s yelling "Party!!!!" "PAAAARRTYYYY!!!!" over and over. After a while Arty stumbles up on stage and sits down in front of the drum riser with the bass drum right behind him. Lou introduces Arty.
As usual everyone got all nice and crowded around in front of the stage.
I can’t remember the song order or anything. It was all stuff from the first album. I remember "does it float" was done pretty nicely. At some point the PA got turned off. It’s not that they were too loud or anything. This is J, before he got a Marshall. I think they must have offended the sound guy or something. But Lou can scream loud enough that he doesn’t really need a PA!
At the end J and Lou started running around the stage. Then they fell over and let their instruments feedback while Pat just kept drumming away. It was about a 1/2 hour set. I think they got discouraged because the PA was cut off. Or maybe they were told to quit…
The other bands sucked. The Melarians were a sort of retro/twist band specializing in "96 Tears." They ought to have been good but, well, I was not very open minded to that type of thing at the time, so maybe they were not too bad. Eighth Route Army, who also sucked, were a sort of punk/Areosmith wanna-be type band who mostly did covers. I knew the bass player at a later time and he is cool (for a guy who digs Areosmith any way.)
But forget them! J stood in a prominent place while the other bands played, jaw slacked, with this freaky look on his face. I think he was trying to get someone in the other bands to crack and make some embarrassing mistake. He has a very disconcerting stare. But it didn’t work… Too bad as it would have been entertaining to see the other bands screw up…
Well… It was free and I enjoyed myself. But I had to hang out in the basement of the art center tying to keep away from those stupid Areosmith tunes because friends I was getting a ride home with were (GASP!) Eighth Route Army fans! It was tolerable because I got to hang out down there and commiserate with some guys who are now sort of famous…
OK
I have not been too many Dinosaur Jr. concerts. But the best one was the first one! I suppose it actually sucked, but I really enjoyed it.
November 1985
Eighth Route Army record release concert.
Location: Third floor ballroom of some arts center in Northampton Mass.
Opening: Dinosaur and the Melarians.I did not even know this concert was happening until I bumped into the band in Northampton that day and they offered to get me (and about 12 others) in free. J was mostly hanging out with his friend Arty. I think the cover of the first Dinosaur album has a picture of Arty on it (I may be wrong about that.) Arty was said to be special because he had an almost perfectly square head (not really, but that was what everybody said.) Maybe that is also his face on the BBC sessions CD…
J was wearing around this very nasty old parka with sort of artificial rat fur around the edge of the hood. Lous’ distinctive clothing included this dumb blue touch football vest with little ties at the sides.
J thought the concert location was cool because if you did not want to pay to get in you could just hang around out side the back door and look through the windows. He looked forward to doing this at future concerts. J and Arty were both offered an intoxicating beverage cleverly hidden in an orange juice carton but they politely refused. Well that’s just more for the rest of us I thought.
I had heard some of the Dinosaur album on the college radio stations in the area. I asked J if I should buy his album. He said: "Naaahhh…" He seemed pretty confident it was not going to make any money.
Anyway we all barged inside the ball room place saying: "We’re with the band!"
So the band gets on stage and ready to go. Lou starts yelling something at the top of his lungs. It sounds like he’s yelling "Party!!!!" "PAAAARRTYYYY!!!!" over and over. After a while Arty stumbles up on stage and sits down in front of the drum riser with the bass drum right behind him. Lou introduces Arty.
As usual everyone got all nice and crowded around in front of the stage.
I can’t remember the song order or anything. It was all stuff from the first album. I remember "does it float" was done pretty nicely. At some point the PA got turned off. It’s not that they were too loud or anything. This is J, before he got a Marshall. I think they must have offended the sound guy or something. But Lou can scream loud enough that he doesn’t really need a PA!
At the end J and Lou started running around the stage. Then they fell over and let their instruments feedback while Pat just kept drumming away. It was about a 1/2 hour set. I think they got discouraged because the PA was cut off. Or maybe they were told to quit…
The other bands sucked. The Melarians were a sort of retro/twist band specializing in "96 Tears." They ought to have been good but, well, I was not very open minded to that type of thing at the time, so maybe they were not too bad. Eighth Route Army, who also sucked, were a sort of punk/Areosmith wanna-be type band who mostly did covers. I knew the bass player at a later time and he is cool (for a guy who digs Areosmith any way.)
But forget them! J stood in a prominent place while the other bands played, jaw slacked, with this freaky look on his face. I think he was trying to get someone in the other bands to crack and make some embarrassing mistake. He has a very disconcerting stare. But it didn’t work… Too bad as it would have been entertaining to see the other bands screw up…
Well… It was free and I enjoyed myself. But I had to hang out in the basement of the art center tying to keep away from those stupid Areosmith tunes because friends I was getting a ride home with were (GASP!) Eighth Route Army fans! It was tolerable because I got to hang out down there and commiserate with some guys who are now sort of famous…
Hey UMASCOW!
EEERRRRR……. Uuhh.. Well…
I guess you were right about that double bass drum pedal that Pat got. I just bought myself a copie of the "Whatever’s Cool With Me" CD/EP. It seems to be a Pat Murphy double base drum pedal showcase!
Although I have to say that in the live version of Thumb on there, you can tell where he takes his foot off the Hihat. It sounds like it’s just for the little thududududut at the end of each section. I think you can hear all the 16th notes he does with his left foot on the hihat during the rest of Thumb are just the same as on Greenmind.
But seriously, sorry about being so insistant.
Oh yeah! An editor at modern drummer said he would bring up the idea of a J mascis interview at their next editorial planning meeting.
I think that jewel cases should be outlawed! I don’t know what a slimline case is but I bet it’s better and more durable then the jewel cases that are commonly used for CDs.
I think a modified DVD case, scaled down to the dimentions of a CD case would be best. I don’t know how many of these silly jewel cases I have broken. And they are also clumsy and dumb looking!!!!
I like the card board cases some CDs come in, but they are less then ideal as they are often complicated.
Actually I wold rather go back to vinyl but that is another story…
The BBC sessions are great. They are worth the ten to fifteen bucks you are going to pay for the CD. Just wander down to the store. If they don’t have it order it. I know it’s old fasioned but music is the property of the musician. You have to have some reapect for that.
Hey Allison!
That link was great!
For those who did not follow her link it goes to a very positive review of "More Light" by Modern Drummer magazine.
They give it an 8 out of 10. Maybe we should encourage them to interview J… It is probably better not to harass them though… I am contacting them. If there is someone at Modern Drummer who would like input from fans I will post his e-mail (with permission.)
I think you could snail mail your encouragement to:
Modern Drummer Publications. Inc.
12 Old Bridge Road
Cedar Grove, New Jersey 07009-1288Hey everybody! Thanks for posting responses!!
Thanks for the dialog UMASCOW. I hope that everybody who reads this notices all the "I think"s and other disclaimers I put in there. Who really knows what is going on in Js head!?!?!
On the "Drums being like Guitar" thing:
What I THINK he meant was that you can emphasize the bassyer notes on One and emphasize the higher notes on Three. One and three being part of a four note stanza: One, Two, Three, Four. Usually there is a bass drum on One and a snare drum on Three. Or where ever the bass and the snare go in a song you can give a little bass or treble emphasis to a chord.
Or you can hit the strings in different ways. If you play with your fingers you can hit the strings with your fingernails on three and give the strings a nice bassy plucking on One. Or you can Hit the middle of the string on one and hit the strings right near the bridge on three.
My favorit song to do this with is "Keep the GLove." I love that dippy drum beat. And it reall comes across when you incorporate it into a guitar strum.
Or Maybe J just meant that when you play guitar one hand usually strums eighth or sisteenth notes while the other hand does stuff within or around that frame work…
I think guitarists should all learn to play drums a little bit. It takes some practice so you are not too clumsy. But:
1.) Drums are a big part of a song. They are loud and unique. If you don’t have an idea what they are going to do and what they can do they are going to take over your songs.
2.) Playing a drum kit you learn better hand foot coordination. Not only does it make you less clumsy but also if you understand the stuff above about sixteenh notes on the bass drum, you know that there is a strong tendency for the foot to follow the hand SLAVISHLY. Drumming can help to give your foot more independence.
So if you want to play things on a wah wah pedal for instance it will be a lot easier. Most guitarists are at a loss trying to play the reggae rhythm guitar part which involves a close coordination between your strum and moving a wah wah. I am sure there are other similarly difficult guitar parts involving an effects pedal.
You are right that the guitar is generally more forgiving then the drums. But you would be surprised how easily the untrained ear misses a screw up on the drums.
As for this brain shaking theory: I don’t know as I have not played much professionally. Although I get the idea that J also feels pretty messed up after a tour. Like he is not sure who he is after having to stand in front of an audience every night for a month. I never read his comment on drummers having upside down brains. I suspect that any probems drummers have would be becase we use a lot of instinct and maybe the logical part of the mind gets flabby. Uhhhhh…….
I will check out that link.
Maybe there should be a drummers forum at FREAKSCENE.NET
Hmmm……
I have read that J does not like to be called a slacker….
But what do you call a guy who is plastered on the cover of SPIN magazine with headline "Is J Mascis God?" and in the article inside the magazine we learn that he still lives with his parents? The perception of the average person who read that article is predictable. They would think J is a slacker. So what do you think? Was that image calculated. I think so. I think J thought that image was the ultimate cool statement and the height of his achievement as far as presenting him self to the general public!
I don’t think J is lazy. He just seems to like being in control I think. But he seems to gain that control by slowing things down to a pace that makes most people itchy and wanting to scratch. Meanwhile J is busy getting the foundation of what he wants to do just the way he wants it so he can build something nice and sturdy.
The man lives a totally different life from the rest of us! That’s why it’s always cool to check out what he’s doing!
(I hope my dogma did not piss on anyones karma… Sometimes it just runs off with the leash!)
Hi Mascow
I seem to be getting incoherent! I did not bother to read your post very well before I responded. Sorry!
Please remember. I have not run across J in about 13 years. I just think it is fun to remember stuff.
I know that when I had a drum kit I could at least attempt to play anything that I have heard on a Dinosaur album. I don’t think I could get the feel right or remember all the fills. I also like ringy drums and rim shots so I would not play in that style. J and Pat like DEAD, REBOUNDLESS toms. They would let the mikes take care of providing volume. J loved Heavy Metal like Motorhead. He always talked about "Philthy Animal" being god. But maybe he was just talking… Anyway I can’t always relate to Js ideas.
A double bass set kind of has a pretensious look to it. Also contrary to popular belief it was not developed to provide endless 16th notes. It was developed by swing drummers for VOLUME. And that is what rock drummers use it for also. 16th notes actually sound better on one bass drum. I have tried using two bass drums and I could not get them tuned to sound the same. I later was told that they are not supposed to be in tune with each other. They sound best tuned 1/2 step different (sharp or flat.)
Keep trying! You can play Budge!!!! Do you have a book with drumming exercises in it? Just try the exercises using base drum and left hand instead of right and left hand. Any pedal will work. You just need to limber up your foot. Like with a stick in your hand you have to get it to bounce and then catch the rebound.
It was cool hearing that they were making it. I always suspected they would. J always had star quality even at his geekyest excesses. And just like he always said he would he lived at home as long as he possibly could.
I bet that Pat would love to play double bass and maybe he did on some albums. But it is more trouble than it is worth. Most drummers have an extra bass drum just for their solos. But I never really got into it so maybe I am wrong. That is just what I read in Modern Drummer magazine when I was a teenager…
Anyway on Budge I am almost positive that Pat is just doing a hand/foot roll. Bounce-bounce on the bass drum and bounce-bounce on the snare.
Have fun!!!
( I really don’t know about those last questions. J did so much overdubbing on most of the albums after Bug. I don’t understand how that is done. But I would lay down the drums first if I were doing it. But I supose it might be hard to follow.)
Yeah, that 16th note bass drum (or snare) stuff is hard to learn at first. The book that me, J and Pat learned it form is called "Realistic Rock" by Carmin Appeice (SIC). There is probably a better book out now.
But it just takes practice. Also you have to learn it bit by bit otherwise that technique can mess with your style and feel A LOT! I don’t really know how else to say that but it opens doors to playing that you are not really ready to play yet when you get over the barriers to that kind of "Ambidexterity" as it is called. You sort of need time to think about it.
The next step after leaning to play 16th notes on the bass drum and snare while playing 8th notes on the hihat is to achieve independence playing a jazz beat. Or maybe I learned other stuff in between there…. I can’t remember….
There is all kinds of other stuff in that "Realistic Rock" book. You probably know other drummers. You can ask them for pointers.
Hi UMASCOW
1.) Thanks for responding to my post! I was a student of Js’ also. He taught me how to twirl sticks and how to do triplets (Tom1, tom2, bass, tom1, tom2, bass, ect.)
2.) I will have to check out Swish.
3.) Hey you know J chose George and not you! I know we all want to be entertained. But maybe J has something different in mind by having George play with him. We are talking about human beings here, right? Not that you don’t have the right to your opinion.
You maybe right in the sense that some of these songs rely heavily on the drummer for their feel and may come across very different with a different drummer. In other words not to your liking. But take it easy!
4.) You are right that Pat can have a lot of energy, but did you ever see Lou play with Dinosaur?
I remember Pat as being kind of a mellow guy. J was the only one who called him Murph. Pats’ friends called him "The Smerf" (when he wasn’t around) because he kind of looked and acted like a giant version of one of those blue cartoon characters. Sort of cool but ready to jump. I guess I can’t get used to everybody calling Pat "Murph."
4.) "Thumb" has double bass fills? I think that is just 16th notes on a single bass drum. Pat was pretty good at that.
5.) My personal opinion about Pat and J is that J got tired of writing songs with Pats’ drumming in mind. I think J wanted to write songs where he could move the song the way only he could. That is just my opinion. Maybe there was a personality thing goin’ on…. Who knows!
6.) The Bottom hi hat cymbal: That is just what he told me and I thought it was significant. There is a funny (sloppy?) hi hat sound on a couple of the songs (Water, Muck, Blowin it, ect…) on "Green Mind." I think that is what he was talking about. Although now that I am checking it out it seems Pat is getting the same sound. Maybe J was B.S.ing me. But he did kind of have his hi hats at an angle and you could hit the bottom cymbal on the edge.
7.) Sabians: I have to check them out again. I got turned off of Sabians when I noticed that the bell on a sabian sounds more like a fire bell then a cymbal bell. Also they have a painted on finish.
J and Pat have distinctive personalities as drummers. Most drummers don’t even have the freedom to express that on a recording. Or maybe they don’t dare because they are afraid some one will think they suck…. J and Pat don’t care if anyone thinks they suck and that is a big part of their sound and feel.
I am especially referring to what J does with tempo. Sometimes he is actually speeding up and slowing down. Sometimes he is just suggesting it by where he places the beat. Pat does that too but in a different, smoother way. It’s a Hard-Core Punk thing. All of Deep Wounds’ songs had tempo changes where most of the song would be moderate tempo but then the chorus would be like… SCREAMING QUADRUPLE TIME! J does magic when he evokes that feel while keeping metronome like time! Or totally sloppy time. Either way, it’s cool.
FOR THE GUITARISTS:
I heard J say a number of times that playing guitar is a lot like playing drums. What do you think of that? It definitely is a way of getting a different feel when playing guitar if you try to evoke the feel of a drum beat, or a drum fill.
